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« Lesbian Couple Booted from Memphis Church | Main | Speaking of Faith Features Lesbian Muslim »

September 17, 2009



thank you for sharing this. i find so much truth in here is hard to put into words. mindless sex, or "cosmic masterbation", if you will, has never lifted anyone to a higher level.

i have seen with my own eyes in the gay community just what you are saying...the entitlement, the celebration of promiscuity, the utter lack of association between love and love making. complete disrespect for the values of others while claiming victimization as others disrespect their values. it's a road that leads nowhere.

classic narcissism. "it's just a matter of mind over matter," my best friend tells me..."if you don't mind..they don't matter."

how cute. but the fact is...they DO matter, and if you don't mind then you live with the consequences you validate yourself. you cannot denegrate and belittle others and then complain about a lack of respect from them.

truth, openess and the only hope we have. we must love them as we love ourselves. short of that...we'll always be just what we are.

love and respect work...i know from personal experience.

much love and hope. pj


I think Andrew Harvey doesn't really know about the incredible work lesbians do in the world. Heavens, lesbians are at the forefront of animal rights activism.

Harvey himself comes off as sort of a cult leader, and on his website, he does not say he is gay. You can't reach him directly by phone or email, it's through his agent, so he never answers emails, and I have never seen him anywhere near lesbian and gay community events. So a lot of his whining about shadows in the gay community are based on his rather aloof and elitiest nature.

He has some interesting things to say about the divine feminine, except when real lesbians question him about this, and then he launches into the weird about mothers and motherhood. I think he is a little bit kooky, but oh well, he can be a loveable eccentric.

nina c.

Pennyjane I don't think you are fair to him. I personally saw him speak at places that other spiritual teachers would never consider (like programs for homeless gay teens involved in sex work).


hmmmm.....nina, are you sure you are speaking to me? i thought my post was rather supportive of mr harvey's comments. if i wasn't clear, i apologize. i think mr harvey made a whole lot of sense and i was glad to read it.

much love and hope. pj

nina c.

Sorry. I meant KT.


Rev Tom Cummiskey

Thanks to all who have commented. Toby Johnson's comments from yesterday (10/11) are wonderful and profound--but I only see them on the shortened page on May they be added here as well?
Rev Tom

Toby Johnson

A wonderful statement by Andrew Harvey: Spirituality not as rejecting the world, but as saving the world.

The natural evolution of consciousness leads us to understand the human religious impulse to be not about adhering to strict purity taboos and rules and restrictions, especially about sex, OR about believing in certain mythological doctrines, but about living in such virtuous ways that the problems and suffering in the world clear up in the course of evolution itself AND that human beings come to understand the world's mythological heritage as metaphors, not dogmas, that are clues to the nature of consciousness and of our oneness with "God." World changing, world saving, world serving activism flows naturally from the realization of who we really are at the level of spirit.

The goal of gay spirituality, I think, is to find for ourselves--and to assist other gay people to see--how our homosexuality can be understood as a clue and an operative practice to experiencing that oneness with "God." The goal of the spiritual life is to experience being in heaven now. Meditation and spiritual practice serve to reveal this transcendental reality; they transform experience so that the world DOES appear and BECOMES heaven now. For gay people spiritual vision sees how the styles of gay life can be perceived as--and thereby transformed into--clues to heaven.

Gay spirituality, for instance, sees that a frivolous whimsy of gay life, like drag (from Radical Faerie-style genderfuck to stage drag and serious female impersonation, from Halloween costume to personal effeminacy) resonate with age-old myths of androgynous, bisexual gods and cross-dressing shamans.

Gay patterns of free and anonymous sex resonate with the mystical poetry of the Sufis and of, specifically, St John of the Cross whose poem "On a Dark Night" is about discovering that the man he has had anonymous "park sex" was Jesus--for all of us, mystically, we are Jesus and Avalokiteshvara and God-incarnate to one another, and should behave so!

The gay encounter with AIDS in the last decades resonates with myths of asceticism, voluntary suffering, mystical substitution and self-sacrifice for the salvation of others--by both the "victims" and the caregivers.

Talents of gay personality, like style, design and artistry and, perhaps even more important, sensitivity, compassion and drive to service, show us the virtues we can and should cultivate for our spiritual growth. Our gayness gives us a perspective on life and cultural convention; we understand the world, other people's lifestyles AND religious tradition from over and above; we should strive to be visionaries and world-transformers. Our attraction to same rather than opposite potentially makes us less distracted and obsessed with duality; we are blessed, if we want to be so, with clues to nondual vision.

The work that Andrew Harvey is doing is so important because it demonstrates--both to the gay world AND to the world at large--the evolution of religion and spirituality. This is line with the great tradition of homosexual and gender-transcending prophets, seers, idealists and spiritual guides. And Harvey reminds us that our spirituality must resonate outward from us to save the world. This is where the evolution of consciousness is taking us all as Earth/Gaia wakes up and we all see heaven now. And, I think, it's a gay thing to point the way.

This is how we, as gay people, give good service by being openly gay AND by transforming what it means to be gay so everybody understands us not as sinners but as saints. This is how we become saints. Spirituality IS self-fulfilling prophecy IS activism in service of humankind.

Toby Johnson, author Gay Spirituality: Gay Identity and the Transformation of Human Consciousness


“The Wine of Divine Grace is limitless. All limits come from the faults of the cup. Moonlight floods the whole sky from horizon to horizon; How much can it fill your room depends on its windows. Grant a great dignity my friend to the cup of your life. Eternal love has designed it to hold its eternal wine.”

I love this paragraph
is so inspirational!!!


I love this paragraph
is so inspirational!!!

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